MENU
Forum

Get up to 12

exclusive bonuses

What's so special about

our bonus reviews?


  • only recommended casinos
  • full wagering requirements
  • terms & conditions analysis
  • bonus value calculation
We respect your privacy and won't share your email address.
[X] Close this form and return to site

GameBet – Complaint

Ruling

Found for the Player - As has become standard for GameBet we have received no response what-so-ever to our repeated attempts to discuss this player's issue with them.

Read our Gamebet Casino Review.

Player's Complaint

As you can see in the attached google link none of my bets at this bookmaker guaranteed me winnings. Their accusation is thus baseless. Double digit bets are no proof of anything as multiple possible reasons exist. Bookmaker which uses term "if we suspect" can basically use this any time against any player so this kind of term is utterly unfair.

Read the casino review

25 Responses

ThePOGG
May 03, 2018

Hi scamrevealer - welcome to ThePOGG.com!

I've deleted the links you included. The conclusions of another service are non-relevant to this process and it is notable that the other service does not actually appear to have been involved in the discussion of your complaint so commenting on whether or not the conclusions reached by the regulator are accurate is somewhat moot.

I have also edited the title of this complaint as at the present time we're not in a position to claim anything is a "scam".

Please detail your issue on this complaint thread. Also note, that you appear to be fixated on whether or not the bets were in violation of the terms quoted. This would be irrelevant if you've been involved in multi-accounting or collusion.

Thanks,

ThePOGG

scamrevealer
May 03, 2018

I deposited altogether 942 Euro to the gamebet sportsbook. After some successful bet s my total balance exceeded 1900 euros but they have not paid me a cent since January 4th.

The accusation I received via MGA is an arbitrage betting so multi-accounting and collusion are excluded as reasons. The google link was supposed to show you that my betting history has not guaranteed me any winnings as opposed to the claim.

ThePOGG
May 03, 2018

Hi scamrevealer,

I'm afraid that fraud and collusion are not excluded as reasons. In fact, they were explicitly listed as reasons in the response the MGA provided to you. If the MGA have chosen to focus on other aspects of the activity that's far from unusual when dealing with fraud related complaints and standard practice is to avoid giving detail of how potentially illegal activity is detected,

Furthermore, the arbitrage betting can actually tie in with multi-accounting and the activity on your account alone would only give part of the picture if this was the case. Arbitrage betting requires two or more bets to be placed that lock a profit. Placing two such bets on the same account would be obvious. Placing two such bets across different accounts would be harder to detect. That being the case, reviewing your bet history alone would not be a deciding factor by itself.

This will ultimately all boil down to whether or not you've engaged in multi-accounting/collusion.

Thanks,

ThePOGG

ThePOGG
May 03, 2018

Hi scamrevealer,

Before we go any further I need you to confirm that you are giving your consent for us to discuss your account details with Gamebet and the Malta Gaming Authority?

Thanks,

ThePOGG

scamrevealer
May 03, 2018

Yes I am giving my consent.

scamrevealer
May 03, 2018

So if I take this right you are helpless regarding this case as the sportsbook belongs to a blacklisted group. Anyway for players´ sake MGA should take some responsibility for not letting this kind of rogue activity continue.

ThePOGG
May 03, 2018

Hi scamrevealer,

I'm not sure where you've taken that idea - GameBet are not Blacklisted here and we can see no connection to any Blacklisted operator.

At the present point in time we're contacting the MGA and GameBet to discuss this issue.

ThePOGG

scamrevealer
May 03, 2018

Yeah I was wrong after rechecking so there is no connection to timesquare casino but anyway this gamebet has been blacklisted by a Russian gaming site due to the fact that it has stopped responding all complaints originating from disappointed users.

scamrevealer
May 25, 2018

Am I right that noone has responded to you regarding this after three weeks?

ThePOGG
May 25, 2018

Hi scamrevealer,

That's correct - they've already been informed of a deadline of next Friday to offer a response.

Thanks,

ThePOGG

ThePOGG
Jun 01, 2018

Hi scamrevealer,

Unfortunately GameBet have been non-responsive to our communications about your complaint.

I've also spoken to the MGA. Unfortunately due to privacy laws, the MGA cannot discuss the details of your complaint without the operator's permission. As the operator are refusing to respond to us the MGA haven't received this permission. They have however indicated (though not confirmed) that this issue is not multi-accounting related.

The above being the case this complaint will be ruled in your favour.

Sorry we couldn't be of more help.

ThePOGG

scamrevealer
Jun 01, 2018

If you want I can bring to you more people who have been scammed by this bookmaker. If MGA was competent it would suspend its licence based on all these complaints but all they care is that they get paid by the company. I have not been paid back even my deposits.

scamrevealer
Jun 01, 2018

What I want you to do is rate at least MGA lower than you do right now.

ThePOGG
Jun 01, 2018

Hi scamrevealer,

Your personal agenda is not of interest or concern to us.

We HAVE worked with the MGA on many other cases and are happy with the work they do. I cannot comment on your case as I do not have access to the information that they had to base their decision on. We're happy to take action against the operator as we've got clear problematic action (or lack there of). We're not going to base action against a regulator on a case were we do not have any confirmable malpractice. We are not contesting whether the operator's position is incorrect given the lack of information. But we are prepared to say that where the operator is non-responsive to complaints that means that we cannot help other players where complaints arise.

Regards,

ThePOGG

scamrevealer
Jun 01, 2018

Would it not help you if I let you log into my account and see my betting history?

scamrevealer
Jun 01, 2018

Like I told you none of the bets gave my guaranteed winnings which is easily provable by anyone taking a look at it.

ThePOGG
Jun 01, 2018

Hi scamrevealer,

Unfortunately this wouldn't make any difference. While your bets may not have delivered you guaranteed profit on your account, this does not prove that you were not working with other account holders that were placing the other bets that would have locked in profit, nor does it prove that you were not offsetting your bets at Gamebet with others at other bookmakers. We would need to see and understand how exactly Gamebet established that your play was problematic and that cannot happen without their cooperation.

ThePOGG

scamrevealer
Jun 01, 2018

Lack of response is because they have not evidence but only suspect.

scamrevealer
Jun 01, 2018

I'm guessing, but I assume you're betting from Finland? If this is correct it affects your consumer and data protection rights, because both Finland and Malta are part of the EU, so Gamebet has to adhere to EU privacy laws.

This is important, because it's impossible to be 100% certain that a customer is involved in arbitrage betting without breaking EU privacy law. I won't go on to explain this fully now, except to say we know how companies get data to make this decision and it is illegal.

We've dealt with a number of cases for UK citizens in this situation and to be honest the companies lie about how they collect data until they know a customer is aware of their practices that break UK law, in your case EU law, but I would also assume Finnish privacy law?

Gamebet can close your account, but I cannot see how they can keep your deposits (winnings?). I would class this as theft, enabled by illegal practice, so I would go back to the MGA explaining this. You can read up about bookmakers online spying in all sorts of places, but if you go to [LINK REMOVED] and enter the phrase 'iesnare' in the search engine you will get plenty of links. Also do the same for the phrase 'Iovation'.

This is a comment I got from an expert.

scamrevealer
Jun 01, 2018

In fact MGA gave as an answer to me that I should seek legal help. Would they have given that kind of answer if they had been provided with enough evidence regarding wrongdoing?

scamrevealer
Jun 01, 2018

I have a whole MGA conversation recorded proving their bad attitude.

ThePOGG
Jun 01, 2018

Hi scamrevealer,

Actually that's fundamentally untrue.

When we contact an operator about a complaint, we do not pass on details of the complaint or complainant at initial contact. We only pass these on at the point where the operator gets back to us. As Gamebet have never responded to us at all they would not be aware who the complainant was or what the complaint was about. That being the case the concept that they failed to respond because they "knew it was you" is in fact entirely baseless.

Furthermore, we're well aware of EU privacy laws and no, it's entirely possible to both remain compliant with privacy laws and still demonstrate that multiple account are working in conjunction. The iesnare reference that you make is something that is used within the industry, but is not something that has ever been presented to us as part of a arbing case. Beyond this though, these fraud detection systems are used in many industries outside of gaming. Whether they are legal under EU consumer law is something for the the courts to decide and if this is the avenue you wish to pursue you need to speak to a legal adviser, not us.

Neither does a company have to demonstrate that it is "100% certain" that you have engaged in arbitrage betting. As with the civil court system, which is what both ADRs and regulators strive to provide an alternative to, they have to demonstrate that within the "balance of probabilities" that their conclusion is the most likely one that would result in the factors they've presented having occurred.

And as to the retention of deposits, that would entirely depend on whether or not the operator/MGA had determined that your activities could potentially constitute fraud or a money laundering risk. Of course neither the operator nor regulator would inform you about this, nor us without significant legal contracts in place and often not even then, but if that's been determined then they would be within their legal rights to decline to engage in any further transactions with you. In fact they would be required to disengage in any further financial transactions with a party suspected of criminal activity. This may or may not be the case in this situation, but we cannot determine the facts of this aspect without cooperation of the relevant parties and are not about to make accusations without having sound ground to do so.

Our position is based on what we can demonstrate to be true. What you claim is not representative of "fact" simply because the operator refused to cooperate with this service. I'm sorry you are unhappy with that position, but it is final.

Regards,

ThePOGG

scamrevealer
Jun 02, 2018

It seems to be the case that whenever a customer has repeatedly taken advantage of odds which are somewhat higher than industry average they have refused to pay out. Sometimes they have used term "speculation" instead of arbing. I am speaking multiple cases which can be found on Russian forum where this bookmaker has been blacklisted. In all those cases people have been returned their deposits anyway. So are they within their rights to determine who "fraudster" deserves to be paid deposits back and who does not?

ThePOGG
Jun 02, 2018

Hi scamrevealer,

If we had evidence to support that decisions were being made on this bases then we would of course support you. However we don't. And we do have a 3rd party regulator who we have experience working with on dozens of different cases that specifically hasn't made decisions on this basis in the past.

Arbitrage betting in itself is perfectly legal. However, it is prohibited by the majority of bookmakers and they are within their rights to close your account where they detect it. This unfortunately creates incentive for other activities that are not legal to either mask what an Arbbing player is doing by spreading their activity over multiple accounts or increase their profit by leveraging multiple accounts for additional profit. The use of multiple accounts (i.e. using accounts under names other than your own) is not only prohibited by terms and conditions but does constitute fraud under EU law. Not all Arbbing players multi-account and we wouldn't accept a claim of fraud based solely on the fact that the player has been identified as an arbitrage player, but it does warrant a cautious approach when basing conclusions on a lack of information.

And this would be a point that specifically concerns me about your case. In the first instance you already reference knowing other players with similar experiences, are directing us to Russian forums - a jurisdiction that has unfortunately had a higher instance of fraud in recent years than most countries - and the expert you've chosen to consult and quote, while they certainly seem to have a good idea of what iesnare/Iovation does and have an interesting view point on the use of this software, are fundamentally incorrect about what type of player is likely to experience problems of this nature due to this system. Iovation is a device finger printing system. While this has application in the gambling industry, it is not a gambling activity analysis tool. To my knowledge it does not have the ability to review your betting activity at bookmakers to match that activity up and determine whether or not you have engaged in arbitrage betting. It does have the ability to determine whether multiple accounts have been accessed from the device you are using. Put another way, Iovation isn't something that's used to identify Arbing players. It's used to identify accounts that are high risk in terms of fraud.

If this is nothing more than a case of arbitrage betting then we would obviously support you. But we cannot reasonably determine based on the information we have whether or not that is the case. As the operator has been the road block to gaining further information we will support you on that basis, resulting in a 'Found for the Player' complaint status and a 'Not Recommended' review status, but we will not extend those conclusions to encompass supposition about the reality of what's actually gone on here.

And as far as rights to determine who gets paid and who doesn't, every organisation that engages in the processing of financial transactions is legally required (this isn't a "right", it's an "obligation" that can see key members of staff face jail time if they fail to adhere to the rules) to cease to carry out financial transactions with any party that they have sound basis to believe may be engaged in any form of criminal activity. So what you refer to as a "right" is actually something with wide scale and potentially significant negative implications for gambling operators if they are found not to be adhering to the rules.

At this stage I think I've been clear about our position and reason for it and feel that this conversation is not covering ground that we've already covered. As such, unless further comments produces new or useful information they are not going to be approved.

ThePOGG

ThePOGG
Jun 06, 2018

Hi scamrevealer,

As you've already been informed further comments going over information that has already been covered will not be approved.

With regard to the MGA telling you to seek legal advice - they haven't told you anything. They will have advised you that you can. That's standard procedure for any ADR/regulator to ensure that a consumer that is unhappy with their decision knows that their rights to seek court review has not been impacted by the ADR/regulator's involvement. It does not offer any opinion on the case itself. Obviously, if the MGA didn't feel that there was enough evidence they wouldn't support the operator and certainly wouldn't then tell you that if they had.

ThePOGG

Leave a Reply

You must be logged in to post a comment.