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Hi Finera - welcome to ThePOGG.com!

What game were you playing?

Thanks,

ThePOGG

Hi Finera,

Did you exit the game after triggering the free spin feature, then go back into the game and play the free spin feature after the bonus restriction associated with the bonus you received had been lifted?

Thanks,

ThePOGG

No, I as far I remember I did not.  Right after I finished the game I made the withdrawal. That's all

Hi Finera, 

I'll contact the operator and see what we can find out, but your response doesn't embue a great deal of confidence. If you have delayed a bonus feature in the manner described above there will be nothing we can do to help you.

ThePOGG

Hello,
Do you have some news for me? Were you able to find out anything from casino?

May I aske you again if there is an update?

Hi Finera,

I've discussed this matter at length with the operator. There was a bug with their bonus system that resulted in your bonus funds being moved to your cash balance prior to the wagering requirement for the bonus being completed. Due to this, your attempted a withdrawal prior to having completed the bonus requirements, which would ordinarily void the bonus contract. This is the position that the operator originally took.

However, after our dialogue the operator are prepared to offer two options:

i) Your balance will be restored, but you will have to complete the wagering requirements while adhering to the original terms of the bonus.

ii) You can receive a refund of your deposit.

Let us know which you would prefer.

Thanks,

ThePOGG

Hello. I would like the casino to be restore my balance and I will complete the wagering requirements if they tell me how much I have to wager. Thank you for your help!

Hello ThePogg!

The casino still did not restore my balance!

Hi Finera,

I've concluded an extended dialogue with VIP Spel about this situation and sadly the offer that they presented originally was not reflective of the reality of what they were offering.

The reality of what has occurred here is that during the wagering for the bonus you had claimed there was a bug in VIP Spel's system that resulted in your bonus funds being moved to cash funds significantly before the wagering requirement was completed (approximately €10300 remained). At this point your balance was €18.40.

Presumablely unaware of this issue, you played on and your balance rose to over €580. You then looked to withdraw.

At the time of the issue at the end of 2020, VIP Spel's position was that you had 'taken advantange of a software bug' and they used term 19 to void your balance.

Our first issue with the above would be one of language - is it actually possible to 'take advantage' of a bug that you were not aware of? There are arguements to be had for both sides of this particular point, but the construction of the term certainly implies exploitative actions. However fundamentally this is irrelevant due to a far more basic issue. The bug could easily be corrected.

This bug was a simply case of a failure in a wager tracker. All VIP Spel needed to do rectify the bug entirely was to sum the wagers placed after the bug occurred, deduct them from the remaining wagering requirement, reject your withdrawal and request that you complete the wagering requirement before resubmitting. That they did not do this in the first instance, and instead defaulted to seizing the balance is problematic.

Come back to their offered resolution. When they offered to "credit the funds to the player’s bonus balance that remained before the wagering was complete", what they missed out was that they did not intend to restor your balance at the time of withdrawal, but rather the balance at the time the wagering stopped tracking correctly. This means that any wagers placed after the bug are considered void.

This is extremely problematic on a number of fronts. Firstly, VIP Spel have presented no evidence to suggest that you would have been aware of the bug, though they have cited terms relating to players having to inform the operator of any bugs they encounter as grounds for non-payment. So had these wagers lost, the operator would have retained the losses, but as they won, they're now looking to void them.

Secondly, nothing has been presented that suggests the fairness of these wagers was in any way impacted by a bug in an entirely separate system.

Finally, as pointed out above, this consequences of the bug were straightforward to rectify.

Instead of simply rectifying the issue, VIP Spel has chosen to try and use an error in their system as grounds to financially penalise players by avoiding paying winnings. 

We cannot support and do not endorse the solutions this operator has chosen to present. However, it is your choice which you find more appealing:

i) Having a balance of €20 restored (they very generously rounded up.....) with a €10300 wagering requirement.

or

ii) Having your deposit refunded.

Let us know what you would prefer.

ThePOGG

Dear ThePogg,

Thank you for such a detailed answer, in which case, I would like the casino to return my deposit to me! I expected the casino to give me back my full balance.

Hi Finera,

Sadly, VIP Spel have informed us that is no longer a possibility.

When the money returned did not match the expected balance, we made enquiries as to why there was a discrepancy. Apparently the operator have counted the time spent exchanging emails to get to the bottom of the discrepency towards the very short expiry period on the bonus (5 days) and as such the bonus has now expired and they consider the matter concluded.

It should also be noted at this stage that VIP Spel have stated that the grounds for voiding wagers after the bug is that they cannot confirm that the bug has not impacted the outcome of the wagers. To be clear about this, we're almost a year after this issue occurred, and VIP Spel's position is that they still do not understand the full extent of what happened or whether the integrity of their games was impacted. That being the case, they are either misrepresenting that there is some possibility that game fairness was impacted to try to legitimize voiding wagers that would otherwise stand, or they have very serious game integrity issues that they have failed to investigate properly and which could impact a large number of other players.

In our professional opinion, at no point during this dialogue has this operator actually in good faith engaged in any effort to resolve this issue. They have looked to deployed technicality after technicality to avoid the readily apparent and easily actioned solution to this issue that could have been acted on without any need of 3rd party intervention.  This was a very basic issue that the operator have to our mind looked to misrepresent to their own advantage.

Sorry we could not be of further help.

ThePOGG

VIP Spel have manipulated a system error that was their fault and was easily corrected to try to legitimise non-payment of a player.

04.12.2020 I deposited in casino and played with the bonus. I was lucky to win 586 EUR and send my documents to verify the account. My account was verified but after I received an email that I violated the terms of the bonus. Here is a part of that email: "-  it's not allowed to use bonus funds purely to progress through the bonus stages and then final stages completed with cash bets when bonus funds have been released or reaching a bonus feature, exiting the game to later go back and play the feature after the bonus funds were used.
 
 As seen in your game history you have transferred winnings from the bonus bet to the real money game.  
 
 The above-mentioned violations are viewed by the Casino as bonus abuse. More information is available in VipSpel General Bonus Terms."
 
 I tried to find out what it means but casino support could not explain me anything. Maybe you can help me. I really would  like to know what I did wrong. 

VIP Spel casino - bonus triggering issue

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