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Hi dschungeltom - welcome to ThePOGG.com!

Can you please forward on your email dated the 1st of March and any other communications you've had with the operator about your Self-Exclusion to <a href="mailto:complaints@thepogg.com" rel="nofollow">complaints@thepogg.com</a>?

Thanks,

ThePOGG

Hi ThePogg,


i have forwarded the concerning email to complaints@thepogg.com

Kind regards

[EDIT]

Hi dschungeltom,

Thank you for forwarding your emails.

Unfortunately your case is not nearly as clear cut as you are representing.

While you did indeed tell the operator to close your account due to "gambling problems" this came only at the end of an extended conversation where you were looking to pressure the operator to offer you increased promotional incentives to retain your play and you went so far as to state that the reason you continued to play with Casino Extreme was that you liked the fast withdrawals, but that there were other MGA license operators who could offer you the same that you could go and play with. Effectively your request was tagged on at the end of a conversation that made clear that you weren't actually concerned about your gambling activity, but looking to punitively withdraw your custom from the operator because they were not providing you with the bonus you wanted.

Self-exclusions are intended as a tool to help users who are genuinely struggling to control their own gambling, not to allow players to leverage the threat of withholding business to pressurise the operator to improve the incentives they are offering you.

While we will contact the operator on your behalf - I remain concerned that your account was re-opened after this - having reviewed your interactions with the operator I cannot say that it comes across at all as a genuine Responsible Gambling based closure request.

ThePOGG

Hi ThePogg,

to be honest a vulnerable player uses every argument to go on with his addiction and searches for ways to extend his gameplay.

In this case i was frustrated not to get a free bonus because of massive deposited amounts. It was not my intention to put pressure on the operator. I only wanted to go on with gambling.

Furthermore i recognized at the end of my message that i have a problem.

And btw between the email you are referring to and the email with the self exclusion request last two or three days.

The final email with the request to self exclude for five years contained no further begs for bonus offers. 

It was clearly stated as a self exclusion for five years without any other comments.

After this email the self exclusion was confirmed by the operator for five years by email. 

And after such a confirmation i expect that the self exlusion is final. 


Kind regards

[EDIT]

Hi dschungeltom,

Having dealt with hundreds of self-exclusion related cases I'm very familiar with the strategies employed by gambling addicts. However, while I do not question your issues, I do not agree at all that the behaviour you exhibited in your communications with the operator is due to gambling problems.

You state that you "recognised at the end of my message" that you had a problem. Frankly, that is a massive and profound realisation to have happened between one line of text and the next. Having read the communication, it seems more likely that this was your final gambit to try and encourage the operator to offer a bonus rather than a genuine acknowledgement of an issue or request for help.

As I said, I do not doubt or question that you have experienced gambling issues, but I will be clear that I do not feel that this chain of communications was actually intended at the point where it occurred to be a request for assistance rather than an effort to evoke a promotional incentive. Subsequent reflection after further losses seems likely to have resulted in an acceptance of an issue.

Thanks,

ThePOGG

Hi ThePogg,


however the final self exclusion was intended as a serious gambling problem. 

In the past i closed the account and reopened it in a basic way for a dozend times in the last three months. I also put deposit limits on the account and revoke it again for dozend times, too. Definetly not a normal behaviour.

If i would act they way you think i did i would have closed the account in a basic way and i would not have used the hard way of a self exclusion for five years.

Keep in mind that the operator itself offered me a bonus everytime i closed my account in a basic way like:

Good day [EDIT],

Hope you're well.
Your account has been deactivated as you  requested.
50 Euros free chip will wait for
you if you want to try it again.
I wish you
a beautiful day.

Kind
regards
[EDIT]
Casino Extreme

This was e.g. four days before i placed my request for a self exclusion.

To end this on off behaviour that brought me in serious trouble i placed the self exclusion. 

But however, independent on the above.

The operator confirmed a self exclusion for five years. And after this i could go on with gambling.

In my opinion this is not ok. Because when a deceision is made i should rely on this.

With your argumentation i never could self exclude because i asked for bonus offers in conjunction with an account closure in the past.


I only want to make my position clear to you and i do not want to argue.

I really appreciate your effort in handling gamblers issues and i am happy that there are people who do this - independent on the outcome of my case.

I wish you a nice weekend

[EDIT]

Hi dschungeltom,

Yes you asked for a self-exclusion. But you only did so as a last resort when the operator made clear that they were not prepared to offer you any further incentives. You are correct that you could have simply asked to close your account. However, given the intransigence shown by the operator with regard to this issue, asking for a self-exclusion makes a far stronger statement - that of "if you don't give me a promotion you'll lose me forever". The operator are as aware as you that if you only ask for a closure you can re-open the account at any time. 

I simply don't accept that in the space of moments your objectives changed from looking for further promotional incentives to asking for help with gambling addiction. That is not a plausible narrative. While I do accept that you do genuinely have a gambling problem, I do not accept that was the driving force behind your request.

Regardless, and as stated at the start, I have concerns that your account was re-opened under these circumstances. Whether or not the motivation was genuinely to request help or to apply pressure to encourage promotional incentives, there is a serious question as to whether the account should have been re-opened which we will look to discuss with the operator. Any resultant ruling however will take into account ALL factors including a full review of your interactions with the operator and consider any regulatory standards that the operator may be subject to. At this stage I am simply being clear that even with a basic review this case is not as straight forward as you having asked for a self-exclusion and them having ignored it.

Thanks,

ThePOGG

Hi dschungeltom,

The operator are contesting the legitimacy of the email you have forwarded to us, stating that it did not contain the statement ", because i face an upcoming gambling problem".

What I need you to do is create a video of your computer screen showing you logging into your Yahoo email account, accessing your sent folder, going to the 25/02/2019, opening the message you forwarded to us and ensuring that we can clearly read the full message.

Once you've created this video, upload it to YouTube as a private video and give the email address webmaster@thepogg.com permission to view it.

Thanks,

ThePOGG

Hi dschungeltom,

If we haven't heard from you by Friday the 21st of June I'll assume you no longer want our assistance with this issue and close this complaint.

Thanks,

ThePOGG

This player claims to have sent an email stating they had gambling problems to Casino Extreme, but has been unable to provide verifiable evidence of this.

Dear Sirs,
 
 I played in Casino Extreme since 12/2018.
 
 After losing bigger amounts i closed my account in a normal way.
 
 After receiving bonus offers i reopened the account.
 
 This happened a few times.
 
 No problem with that.
 
 But on 1st March 2019 i requested a self exclusion for the next five years because of facing a gambling problem.
 
 It was answered with the following email:
 -----
 Dear [EDIT],
 
 Hope you're having a great day.
 Your request has been processed, you will not be able to play in Extreme in next 5 years.
 
 Kind regards
 XXXX
 Casino Extreme
 
 ------
 
 But the account was still open. After asking me in a cashback request I wrote them the self exclusion was an error.
 
 They accepted this and i could go on with gambling.
 
 In my opinion this is not correct. They should know that a problematic gambler uses these arguments to play again.
 
 A self exclusion should be a protection even when it is already confirmed.
 
 In march i totally lost 7857,- Euro (deposits - wihtdrawals)
 
 I have now closed the account again and this time they have processed it.
 
 But i would like to have my net losses back in march.
 
 Before publishing this complaint, it would be great to know your opinion if this behaviour of the casino is not correct.
 
 All emails and screenshots can be delievered if needed.
 
 
 Kind regards
 
 [EDIT]

Casino Extreme - Self exclusion not strictly fulfilled

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