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Casinsi - Problem with the Aspire Global casinos

Ruling

Found for the Casino - There do not appear to have been any transactions processed after the point where the player made a clear request for a self-exclusion.

Read our Casinsi Casino Review.

Player's Complaint

Dear Sir/Madam,

I played at Aspire Global around 2 years ago for the first time and I want to complain about Casinsi.com and Jaak Casino. I played with a lot of money there and finally I was lucky and won around 30.000 euros. Aspire Global is claiming on all the websites that they are helping and detecting players with gambling problems. This is a great goal and text but in fact, they are not doing anything. I had contact earlier with them about the way they treat me as player, the director checked my story but didn't want to give me an excuse and/or financial compensation. So I contacted with the Dutch government(Kansspelautoriteit) about the case, I showed them the chat history, what happened and they recommend me to first solve the problem with Malta Gaming Authority (and they send me to The POGG) before they are going to work on the case. So that is why I'm sending this e-mail now.

I asked Aspire Global to deliver the chat history as a proof on Casinsi.com and Jaak Casino. Unfortunately they not delivered all the chats I had with them with the various brands they have and they don't respond anymore.. I marked the interesting conversations that are proofing my summary of bad treatment in yellow(please sent me an e-mail where I can send this Word document to). Here a summary of they bad way of treating me from Aspire Global conform the Responsible Gaming Policy

- They were canceling withdrawals of me without reason.

- They were not seeing the signals that I was depositing way too much money.

- Even when I was asking for closing my account, they were trying to keep me there with bonuses and free bets. Instead of closing it directly because I was obvious an addicted player.

- They were reopening my account instanlty, even when I was asking a several times before to close it permanent.

- When I won 30.000 I asked if it was possible to close my account for a month, So I could cool of, they told me it was not possible.

- They told me when I won 30.000 that there was a maximum of 7.000 withdrawal/month. When I lost the money, they told me when offering a bonus they could upgrade me to platinum VIP so I could withdraw more.

I had contact with Aspire Global to finish this case in the first place with themselves, but I didn't get an excuse and/or financial compensation. I hope, even after two years, to get an excuse of Aspire Global about this way of treating an addicted player with a financial compensation. I know in the end, spending and losing money is the own responsibility of the players. I recognized it myself, I tried to stop it, I asked them to stop me but they were just teasing me with better bonuses. And when I won, they were trying to make me losing it all.

I hope The Pogg, can warn and check a lot of active cases of Aspire Global because they are not protecting their players. That is the most important thing to me. Ofcourse, I also want an excuse of them and an financial compensation because I lost a lot of extra money because of their bad responsible gaming policy. I think this treatment is not in accordance with the requirements that MGA wants to stand for. This was simply not necessary if they were doing what they preach: protecting addicted players.

I'm looking forward to your reply.

Kind regards,

Read the casino review

21 Responses

User icon
ThePOGG
July 17, 2020

Hi epicjoe888 - welcome to ThePOGG.com!

As we are the ADR for the Apsire Global license under the Malta Gaming Authority license there is certain information we have to provide you now.

You can find all the relevant information about this service here – http://thepogg.com/terms-of-use/ and the terms of use for our complaint service here - https://thepogg.com/terms-of-use-for-dispute-resolution-service/

To summarise.

– Use of this service does not preclude your seeking redress through court proceedings .

– This service is free to use for both the complainant and operator.

– At any point during the procedure the submitting party retains the right to withdraw their complaint. This does not preclude our right to continue the discussion with the involved operator of general issues related to the complaint (i.e. insufficiently clear terms and conditions).

– You are not obliged to obtain independent or legal advice or representation, though you may choose to do so.

If you have any questions about the above, let me know.

Before moving forward we need to cover some sections of your complaint.

Firstly, did you ever directly tell the operator that you had a gambling problem? Or ask to "self-exclude"? Asking to "close" your account would not be treated as a responsible gambling issue without a clear indication from yourself that you were not in control of your actions.

Similarly, where an account has just been "closed", you would be allowed to re-open the account at any time simply by requesting that this happen.

And where you have asked to close your account, but not indicated that the reason for this is related to addiction, it would be quite normal for the operator to offer an incentive to continue playing with them.

Most operators carry withdrawal limits. And VIPs are offered higher limits than other players.

Do you have a record of the communication where the operator told you it was not possible to engage a cooling-off period on your account?

Thanks,

ThePOGG

User icon
epicjoe888
July 17, 2020

Dear ThePOGG, Thanks for the answer and clear information. Here my answers: Firstly, did you ever directly tell the operator that you had a gambling problem? Or ask to "self-exclude"? Asking to "close" your account would not be treated as a responsible gambling issue without a clear indication from yourself that you were not in control of your actions. Similarly, where an account has just been "closed", you would be allowed to re-open the account at any time simply by requesting that this happen. I asked a lot of times for self exclusion, but they were giving me bonuses all the time to stay longer. I really had to beg for closure every time. During 2 years I played on a several brands of Aspire Global: Casinisi, Pirate Spins etc. They dont wan't to give me all the chats that I had on all the brands with them, but maybe as ADR you can ask for it and read all the chats from all labels. Also when I opened a new account on another website from them, they always accepted me as new player. And where you have asked to close your account, but not indicated that the reason for this is related to addiction, it would be quite normal for the operator to offer an incentive to continue playing with them. I gave the reason, and they can also read behavouir. It was clear that it was not natural. Most operators carry withdrawal limits. And VIPs are offered higher limits than other players. Regards, [EDIT]

User icon
epicjoe888
July 17, 2020

Here is some interesting prove from the chat history. I'm busy with also the chat history of Pirate Spins, where you can find more bad customer help conversations. But here the first proof: Conversation 1 - 2018 (I mention here a gambling problem with other words, watch how se is 'treating' me with a very big bonus): 2018-12-06T18:03:06+00:00 Patricia: Hey there and welcome:) I'm Patricia How are you today ? 2018-12-06T18:03:14+00:00 you: Soo bad lost so much money 2018-12-06T18:03:58+00:00 Patricia: Can I please ask you to kindly confirm your Username and your Full name. As well as your Address, Telephone numbers and Email address you registered with us on opening your account. [EDIT] But again: some chats are missing. Maybe they don't send me everything, because they know they were wrong at some times. Thats why I asked again to send everything, I hope they will do and otherwise.. I hope the POGG can get them. Specially the part where you can find the way they teasing me and making it me impossible to cashout properly when I won a lot of money is interesting. I hope you can help me in this case, because its simply not fair and how a casino should act with responsible gaming.

User icon
ThePOGG
July 18, 2020

Hi epicjoe888,

While we can ask to review your Live Chat history, what you are requesting is a needle in a haystack type endeavour. Your not bringing us a specific issue to review, you are asking us to review everything to see if there are any issues. The workload implications are radically different.

Further to this, having reviewed what you've posted above there would not be any significant concerns. The majority of occasions that you've requested an account closure above you have not given any indication of gambling addiction. You have made a number of closure requests, but these do not appear any different to the standard approach many players take in requesting closures to try and elicit the operator to offer more, or better, bonuses.

Where you do make a full self-exclusion request, the next contact where you ask to re-open is not actioned until a 7 day cooling-off period has been applied. That would be the correct protocol in this circumstance as required by the MGA license.

In fact, the operator has actioned a 6 month self-exclusion when you only asked them to close the account for 6 months (beyond what they would be required to do) and when you were re-opening your account applied a 7 day cooling-off period where they were only required to provide 24 hours for a defined self-exclusion.

In short you should expect that this case will take significant time to review and I would stress that based on the examples you have provided we would not have a high degree of expectation of providing you the desired result.

Thanks,

ThePOGG

User icon
epicjoe888
July 25, 2020

Hi The Pogg,

Thanks for the answer. I think I said very early with different words, that I had a problem with gambling. So, for me enough reason to go further with this case.

Because I'm missing all the chats where I was asking for temporary blocks, or other possibilities like freezing my money, because I won 30k+ and didn't want to play further anymore. I also just could cashout, 7.000 /month. They didn't offered me any protection. Later when I lost all the winnings and asked to block my account, they told me I'm a VIP player and they offered me unlimited cashouts and even told me temporary breaks were possible. So, I think some crucial data that they don't want to show because I'm right.

So, they don't want to provide me all the chats/contact we had, they removed some controversial conversations, but are not responding on my request to provide them. Could you contact them to ask all the communications? Or how is it working? Based on the story above, you could conclude that Aspire Global didn't treat me well, right? With the right protections.

Regards,

User icon
epicjoe888
August 3, 2020

Hello, do you have an update for me regarding the case?

User icon
ThePOGG
October 11, 2020

Hi epicjoe888,

A brief update - we are still sorting through your communication records with this operator. We will revert to you with a verdict once that process and reached its conclusion.

Thanks,

ThePOGG

User icon
epicjoe888
October 19, 2020

Hi ThePOGG,

Thanks for the update. I'm looking forward to the conclusions.

Regards.

User icon
ThePOGG
October 30, 2020

Hi epicjoe888,

Can you clarify - approximately when did you register/play with Casinsi/Jaak Casinos?

Thanks,

ThePOGG

User icon
epicjoe888
October 30, 2020

Hi ThePOGG, I started around October/November 2018 there. I played in at least 3 brands of Aspire end of 2018/begin of 2019, those one for sure: Casinisi, Jaak Casino and Pirate Spin. After I continued a several times, when they accepted me as a player again. After a certain time, you could see the 'switch' that they were acting like a responsible gaming. Maybe after more of those cases? Or reprimands. But when I played in the beginning, literally nothing was reflected in this. I hope they want to send you all the documentation/conversations, instead of a selective selection to get away with it. Especially all the conversations that I can remember about the 'you are a VIP' player parts, I can offer you this etc. are very interesting. Thanks in advance, [EDIT]

User icon
ThePOGG
October 31, 2020

Hi epicjoe888,

As was explained on the 18th of July, the nature of the interactions you have provided above would not result in the operator being expected to exclude you. Many players use the threat of closing their account to try and pressure the operator into providing promotional incentives that they would not otherwise have received. There needs to be either a clear request from the player with an acknowledgement of a control issue or significant evidence of an indirect fashion (repeated statements of sever emotional distress or indications of potential damage to life of health would be examples of this).

Having reviewed your interactions with the operators on this license, there are a number of occasions where you make a request that the agent interprets as a self-exclusion request or the agent directly informs you your closure request has been treated as a self-exclusion. These do include points where you ask for this to be extended across the license. However these occur towards the end of 2019. We will now look to review with the operator whether you were allowed to play after this point, and if so why that occurred.

Thanks,

ThePOGG

User icon
epicjoe888
October 31, 2020

Thanks for investigating this case.

It is indeed true as an experienced player that I sometimes wanted to block my account, but received an attractive bonus and therefore continued to play. Finally you can think a lot about that, but if you choose to continue playing, you are finally responsible yourself, I agree.

However, I do have some questions, because I do not know the exact legislation, so I have the following questions to clarify things:

- If you ask for a permanent closure of an account, are providers allowed to open your account with just 1 email, without a cool-down period? This is what happened at Aspire Global LTD.

- If you have asked Aspire Global casino X to permanently close your account? Isn't it by definition forbidden to simply accept players on other brands within the same parent company? I see that this does happen at many other casinos, so it is a mystery to me why Aspire Global always accepted me, even though I was supposed to be PERMANENTLY excluded from their company from several brands.

- If you ask 3 times for permanent self-exclusion in half an hour, is this not a signal to block a player permanently for all brands? This is what happened at Aspire Global LTD.

- When its necessary to almost beg, to exclude yourself, is this normal and legal? This is what happened at Aspire Global LTD.

I also still have doubts whether all conversations are now shown by Aspire Global LTD. I think it's saying a lot that the conversations were sent to me in an apparently selective cut and pasted Microsoft WORD file in which concrete evidence is simply missing.

Earlier I spoke about missing chats where I was asking for temporary blocks, or other possibilities like freezing my money, because I won around € 30,000 on Casinsi and € 12,000 at PirateSpin, and didn't want to play further anymore. At that time, it was possible to pay out only € 7,000 per month per brand. Thats why I was contacting with the customer service by chat, to clarify the following things:

1. Is it possible to pay out more per month? Because I am a VIP player and they clearly stated on the benefits page of their VIP program that VIP players could pay more in consultation. Unfortunately, when I had won this huge amount, they indicated that this was not possible.

2. For that reason I then asked if it was possible to lock out for more than 24 hours, clearly explaining that I was afraid that I could not control myself and therefore did not want to continue playing. Here too they indicated that this was not possible, they also offered no alternative at all and seemed completely focused on just letting me lose the money.

Because I couldn't control myself -as predicted-, I lost all the winnings and asked to block my account. I then spoke with the VIP manager, who as a VIP player again tried to tempt me with several bonuses. When I explained the problem why I absolutely wanted to block because they offered bad conditions(see above) when I won a lot of money and played me, all of a sudden the manager said it was no problem at all to pay out more than € 7,000 a month and even said that temporary exclusions if I would win a lot of money again would be possible. After this information I felt really scammed to be honest.

The above conversations have taken place 100%. However, I have not seen any of this in the sent chats. Therefore again a number of questions:

Has Aspire Global LTD already sent these chats to THEPOGG? If yes, is this legal? If not, how can I prove that these chats took place? What if this organization just deliberately does not give up these chats because they lack this?

Thank you in advance for the further investigation, and apologies for the amount of questions. But it comes to a lot of money, and I am convinced that this company has really fallen short in their responsible playing policy and feel really ripped off by their behavior. I hate that I didn't save the chats in 2018, when this happened. But at the time I had no idea of ​​this website as a mediator.

Greetings,

Epicjoe888

User icon
epicjoe888
October 31, 2020

One thing I forgot to mention about the conversations that Aspire Global LTD hide: I asked a several times in a very polite way to sent them, but they simply don't react anymore.

Greetings,

Epicjoe888

User icon
ThePOGG
November 22, 2020

Hi epicjoe888,

To answer your questions:

1) Yes. An "permanent closure" does not make any statement about addiction issue and as such is not treated as a responsible gambling issue. The operator is under no obligation to prevent you reaccessing the account, or delay access to the account, if they are happy to have you as a player.

2) No. In the first instance, as explained in 1), a closure request does not qualify as a responsible gambling issue. In the second, even where the closure is clearly categorised as a self-exclusion, the operator would only be required to carry the exclusion over to other properties on the license where the excluding player directly requests this happen.

3) If you ask for a "self-exclusion" a single request is sufficient. If you ask to "close" your account we revert to 1).

4) No. A single request to "self-exclude" or a clear statement that you are not in control of your gambling when requesting an account closure would be sufficient to have the account closure treated as a responsible gambling issue.

However, having reviewed your communications with the operator, where you have made a clear self exclusion request, as opposed to simply asking for your account to be closed, this has been managed in line with the standards required by the MGA license.

To summarise - asking for an account closure is not a responsible gambling based action. A closure would only be considered a self-exclusion where you directly ask for a self-exclusion or make a clear statement that you are closing because you feel you are not in control of your gambling.

Moving on to your next set of questions:

1) It's possible for any operator to pay out at any rate they as a business feel is appropriate. However there is not requirement for them to offer a rate faster than their base rate as defined in their terms and conditions to any individual player. This would be a matter of internal policy for the operator to decide.

2) If you can provide an approximate (few days) time that you believe this conversation occurred I can look at the transcripts for you again.

Thanks,

ThePOGG

User icon
epicjoe888
November 22, 2020

Thanks for the answers. Obviously, a bit dubious but if those are the rules then so be it. Going back to my conversations with Aspire Global, they have sent a selection of the conversations to you and me, where they get away with everything. They hold back the conversations I'm referring to, so I don't know what to do about it.

I am glad that the government here is now taking hard actions against casinos with Malta and Curacao licenses, because these authorities have nothing to do with responsible gaming.

User icon
epicjoe888
November 22, 2020

And what are the outcomes of the following part?

Having reviewed your interactions with the operators on this license, there are a number of occasions where you make a request that the agent interprets as a self-exclusion request or the agent directly informs you your closure request has been treated as a self-exclusion. These do include points where you ask for this to be extended across the license. However these occur towards the end of 2019. We will now look to review with the operator whether you were allowed to play after this point, and if so why that occurred.

User icon
ThePOGG
November 26, 2020

Hi epicjoe888,

Can you identify any deposits made to Aspire Global properties after the 24/09/2019? (the date of your license wide self-exclusion?

Thanks,

ThePOGG

User icon
epicjoe888
November 30, 2020

Hi Pogg,

I guess the casino must have this data right? Or are they going to hide essential information again?

I can not access my accounts there anymore, and I see bank transactions to casinos after but the problem with this transactions is that you can not see a real reference to the casinos.

User icon
ThePOGG
December 2, 2020

Hi epicjoe888,

The operator have not hidden anything at this point. The 24/09/2019 is the date that we were able to establish from your Live Chat communications that you made a request that could be clearly understood to be a self-exclusion and clearly stated you wanted it extended to other properties on the license. The operator has been unable to identify any deposits occurring after this date. As such we're asking you to confirm whether this aligns with the information you have. If neither party can provide clear evidence demonstrating a problematic transaction there is no case for us to pursue here.

If you are struggling to locate transactions but genuinely believe they have occurred, please provide the brand and your username for every Aspire Global licensee you have played with and we will request the transaction history for all of them to verify.

Thanks,

ThePOGG

User icon
ThePOGG
December 13, 2020

Hi epicjoe888,

I'm following-up on the above?

Thanks,

ThePOGG

User icon
ThePOGG
December 19, 2020

Hi epicjoe888,

If we haven't heard from you by Friday the 1st of December I'll assume you no longer need our assistance and close this complaint.

Thanks,

ThePOGG

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Agreement

Epic consented for ThePOGG to act on their behalf and share the personal information that they provide to ThePOGG with the following agencies for the purposes of resolving their complaint:

  • Casinsi
  • Malta Gaming Authority
  • United Kingdom Gambling Commission
  • Aspire Global International Ltd

July 17, 2020

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